for real, it clearly imposes on our constitutional freedom of religion for any religion to establish dominance in our government, it is wrong. they can't be saying some religious ideas are right & others are wrong. we do NOT want to be fighting these holy wars.
The irony of this hateful viewpoint is it's self defeating. The entire new covenant is based on the plan that God created to sacrifice his son (Jesus) to absolve all of mankind's sins. If you're a christian, why are you mad about this? Your entire religion is based on the concept of true belief in the sacrificed lamb. Every christian I know confidently acknowledges this sacrifice gets them into heaven. It's another excuse for "good people" to be hateful.
To those who somehow think they have the right to impose their belifs on others: Religion is no business of any government. As non-believers, my husband and I carefully steered our three sons away from religion and other myths; interestingly, all three turned out to be honorable, kind, and productive adults who do not need religion in order to he good moral people. Please respect our non-belief, just as you want us to respect your right to your beliefs.
The Bible states that certain trumped up allegations were made against Jesus for which he was arrested.
The religious leaders of that day amplified those false allegations to discredit him and cause him to be imprisoned.
Jesus was brought before Pontius Pilate, a Roman official, for judgment. Pilate sent him to Herod the Jewish tetrarch. Herod passed the buck back to Pilate.
The religious leaders were there to spread the lies about Jesus.
The crowd was there being roused by the religious leaders.
Pilate was there; he found no fault in Jesus. But the crowd would not be silent.
Pilate offered to release another prisoner, Barabbas who was in prison for insurrection and murder.
Pilate asked them: Jesus or Barabbas?
The religious leaders led the crowd in calling for Barabbas to be set free, and for Christ to be crucified.
The religious leaders in the above story is Fox News.
The crowd in the story are MAGAs.
The two principals— Barabbas and Jesus are candidates.
MAGA rejected the good and gave us all “Barabbas.”
"(Drollinger does not permit women to lead study groups.)"
--My only comment on this is 🙄🙄🙄
Since there are many 'bibles' and an inordinate amount of opinions/writings/suggestions concerning different religions, with groups not agreeing to everything in one religion just forming their own instead, this would seem to me to convince everyone that religion isn't really a "thing" at all. It's all made-up as the whole world turns. And how many wars were started in the name of religion?? Almost all of them.
Can't we just debate (or decide) to give everyone healthcare?
Thanks for the continuing stacks on this subject, well, many subjects.
I'm no Bible scholar but I like to compare the thoughts, beliefs, actions, passions, I witness, with a zealot's opinion of what a person should believe in to be a good "insert word of choice".
I see convenience in religion. I see excuses. I see damnation. I see discrimination. I see a corporate ladder. I see us vs. them. I see hypocrisy. I see apathy.
No one knows. So when that is admitted and radical acceptance is begotten, that we don't know it all, the religion becomes subjective. Faith.
I don't like the government hosting all this on most days of the week. I don't see actions that represent what is the present moment. I see manipulation. I see plotting.
It's like Trump re-litigating 2020. Why is it important to Trump to be all of a sudden DEI everything and think he's a church bro? Antisemitic? Trump couldn't care less. That's my opinion and I have seen nothing to the contrary.
When Vance can go from one position to another, just for his political gains, how does he favor or reconcile Theil's homosexuality?
Everything is cool when something is yours to use religion to justify but, if it is not it becomes debatable taboo, which curses the "others" for their somethings, on nothing more than, the whispers of the wind.
Let's kill more people because that represents social climbing, I heard that from Vance. I heard in the 16 interview, with Vance, that divorce and all the traditional shit, gone wrong, is because of the 25 year olds walking away from religion, but not at that elite YALE place, while he now attacks those foundations, for all the bad, and of what he claims he converted for. Does he control DNA? RNA? Personality? NO .
The Catholics, I knew, sinned all week and then confessed on Sunday. Slate clean!
Are they my issue to solve, call out, believe in or criticize? NO. Meaning those elected or are a part of the decisions that affect humanity and the world we are borrowing and shitting on.
They only owe me a vow, like their droning on marriage, or Oath to my liberties, freedoms, and not impose religion upon me, by upholding and defending the Constitution.
I'd like more sessions in Congress et. al about that subject versus the scrolls we will eventually, perhaps, find out about.
These folks with the inability to set-shift, running the country, should know what they're doing should be done away from the government and its policies, while having a balanced life, autonomous and true to convictions that don't need made public, and come back to their responsibilities to the country.
Actions speak louder than their beliefs in any denomination they "serve" or what Trump says. If they believe Trump they have problems far greater than a prayer session with Drollinger about supporting Israel will ever fix.
They vote as they do. Dems included. Their actions do nothing to impress upon me religion has done much for any of them.
Bible Mike Johnson telling people to "see the Bible if they want to know his beliefs", while having his son be his accountability partner and use an app to keep his wandering eye in check, while having a sketchy, at best, history, is absolute BS.
THE EXCUSE.
I talk to the air, because my faith is that there is something, as it has watched out for me for longer than I deserve, but who am I, to debate the trillion dollars of Medicaid cuts while debating who crucified Jesus?
It is looking at a puzzle book and playing the two picture, what is in one that ain't in the other, game.
It is ok to crime in the government now. Who needs religion as any excuse?
To call this a “study” is generous. It’s a sermon with policy consequences, theological antisemitism shaping military support, all wrapped in breakfast and bureaucracy.
Scripture disguised as strategy. And the real question (though few dare ask, and fewer still will listen or answer): Whose kingdom is really being built?
The irony? It’s the powerful, *the so-called elites*, who figuratively crucify anything that might actually change the system for the better, when all is said… and (un)done.
Drollinger is someone worthy of only contempt. His scriptural gymnastics are like something out of Dr. Strangelove. He and his fucked-up followers are all part of a death cult that gleefully drags us all to Armageddon.
Drollinger and all those misguided fools that are listed as his "supporters" are the one who have truly been "Sidetracked" by the same stupid lies and fairy tales long pushed by white christian nationalists. It is beyond sickening.
One question, actually two. Could anyone but politicians do Bible study as part of their work day? What about the oath to uphold the Constitution and the part about separation of church and state? This is hyper religiosity at its finest. Disgusting.
I am Jewish, although atheist (it is possible, I suppose I could go into it if you really wanted, but that's not the point). My family and I have fought all of my life To prevent attempts of schools, teachers, park district employers, et cetera, from which I'm attempting to convert me to Christianity. How HOW DARE the politicians- the country that is built on freedom of religion continue that attempt?!! And to be honest, I may be Jewish, but neither I nor any living Jew (or Catholic for that matter) could POSSIBLY have had anything to do with killing a man, whether or not he was a “ messiah” a couple of thousand years ago?! And I won't even go into any religious questions involved! Just as one can't be blamed for their grandfather or other ancestor being a murderer, the question of current Jews being blamed for killing a man who was well revered at his time (and again, I won't even go into whether or not he actually existed...). And that our politicians could actually be TEACHING these myths as reality is just unbelievable. have they no SHAME? Do they not actually understand our constitution?- silly question [Clearly not, witness Trump..]
Jesus was well aware of his duty. He was well aware of the steps he needed to complete to confirm the Old Testament Biblical prophecy of his Messianic legitimacy. Judas’ betrayal? Without that, Jesus was not the guy. Keep looking. The Crucifiction. It was written. No Crucifiction. Sorry, not the Messiah. Keep waiting. The fact that Christians “blame” anyone for Jesus’ death or Judas’ role is ludicrous. They should rejoice these events. It should be seen as divine confirmation not condemnation. Bit of a logical hole in the story.
What was their White Anglo-Saxon Jesus doing in Jerusalem in the first place? He should’ve stayed in the still undiscovered America where he belonged. Right? 😉
The WAS (P pending for the next almost 1500 years) Jesus wouldn't have made it to Jerusalem. With that pale complexion he would have never returned after 40 days in the desert.
"In two study guides and videos, right-wing preacher Ralph Drollinger, who runs the Bible studies, made multiple references to Israel, or its people, killing Jesus."
Why would anyone doubt the good preacher (bless his heart) when it's an established fact that not only did the the filthy Jooz directly nailed the Christ to the tree (a shitload of them took turns pounding in the nails), but also that they kidnap good little Christians so they can kill them and drain their blood to make matzos.
-----
"Since Paul’s* a Jew, he doesn’t want his audience to know, well, what happens to the Jews, because they for by and large rejected the messiah."
* There are many, many more people in the world who ***don't*** consider the Christ as the Messiah; just ask a Buddhist, Hindu, Shinto, Zen, Muslim, Taoist, Sikh... if they view the Christ as the Messiah.
* The Jews in the time of the Christ looked upon him as a false prophet at best, and an agent of chaos within Judaism. Jews didn't (and don't) consider the Christ as the Messiah since he failed to meet the prophesies within Jewish holy books and traditions.
* Judaism recognizes that there will be a Messiah, but that the Christ isn't it. They see the Messiah as bringing forth world peace, justice, and a return to spiritualism. (I don't see most parishioners in the Americanized Evangelical movement as trying to do any of the three.) He will be human, not semi-divine or divine, and a direct descendant of King David -- that the Christ did fulfill according to long established Christian doctrine.
* As for peace and justice, Blaise Pascal said "Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction." Or as Thomas Paine said, "It is from the Bible that man has learned cruelty, rapine, and murder; for the belief of a cruel God makes a cruel man."
* I hate to be the one to break it to Drollinger, but not only Paul was a Jew. The Christ and all of the Disciples were Jewish also, as were most of those adherents of the Christ's teachings.
(* When Christianity was still in its infant stage, Paul was responsible for the first major schism in the Church. At this time one had to be Jewish to be Christian, while Paul said that all you needed was to believe:
> "◾ Some Jewish Christians insisted that Gentiles needed to fully convert to Judaism before becoming Christians, while others, like Paul, argued that faith in Christ was sufficient
◾The Council of Jerusalem, recorded in Acts 15, addressed this issue and reached a compromise position
...
◾ Gentile Christianity developed a distinct theological emphasis that set it apart from its Jewish roots
No. It's actually Christian doctrine. And it always has been. "News" such as this exists because people pick and choose factoids out of context instead of doing their homework.
why is there a white house bible "study" in the first place?
for real, it clearly imposes on our constitutional freedom of religion for any religion to establish dominance in our government, it is wrong. they can't be saying some religious ideas are right & others are wrong. we do NOT want to be fighting these holy wars.
The irony of this hateful viewpoint is it's self defeating. The entire new covenant is based on the plan that God created to sacrifice his son (Jesus) to absolve all of mankind's sins. If you're a christian, why are you mad about this? Your entire religion is based on the concept of true belief in the sacrificed lamb. Every christian I know confidently acknowledges this sacrifice gets them into heaven. It's another excuse for "good people" to be hateful.
💯 Came here to say the same thing!
To those who somehow think they have the right to impose their belifs on others: Religion is no business of any government. As non-believers, my husband and I carefully steered our three sons away from religion and other myths; interestingly, all three turned out to be honorable, kind, and productive adults who do not need religion in order to he good moral people. Please respect our non-belief, just as you want us to respect your right to your beliefs.
If I may be permitted to propose an allegory.
The Bible states that certain trumped up allegations were made against Jesus for which he was arrested.
The religious leaders of that day amplified those false allegations to discredit him and cause him to be imprisoned.
Jesus was brought before Pontius Pilate, a Roman official, for judgment. Pilate sent him to Herod the Jewish tetrarch. Herod passed the buck back to Pilate.
The religious leaders were there to spread the lies about Jesus.
The crowd was there being roused by the religious leaders.
Pilate was there; he found no fault in Jesus. But the crowd would not be silent.
Pilate offered to release another prisoner, Barabbas who was in prison for insurrection and murder.
Pilate asked them: Jesus or Barabbas?
The religious leaders led the crowd in calling for Barabbas to be set free, and for Christ to be crucified.
The religious leaders in the above story is Fox News.
The crowd in the story are MAGAs.
The two principals— Barabbas and Jesus are candidates.
MAGA rejected the good and gave us all “Barabbas.”
"(Drollinger does not permit women to lead study groups.)"
--My only comment on this is 🙄🙄🙄
Since there are many 'bibles' and an inordinate amount of opinions/writings/suggestions concerning different religions, with groups not agreeing to everything in one religion just forming their own instead, this would seem to me to convince everyone that religion isn't really a "thing" at all. It's all made-up as the whole world turns. And how many wars were started in the name of religion?? Almost all of them.
Can't we just debate (or decide) to give everyone healthcare?
Thanks for the continuing stacks on this subject, well, many subjects.
I'm no Bible scholar but I like to compare the thoughts, beliefs, actions, passions, I witness, with a zealot's opinion of what a person should believe in to be a good "insert word of choice".
I see convenience in religion. I see excuses. I see damnation. I see discrimination. I see a corporate ladder. I see us vs. them. I see hypocrisy. I see apathy.
No one knows. So when that is admitted and radical acceptance is begotten, that we don't know it all, the religion becomes subjective. Faith.
I don't like the government hosting all this on most days of the week. I don't see actions that represent what is the present moment. I see manipulation. I see plotting.
It's like Trump re-litigating 2020. Why is it important to Trump to be all of a sudden DEI everything and think he's a church bro? Antisemitic? Trump couldn't care less. That's my opinion and I have seen nothing to the contrary.
When Vance can go from one position to another, just for his political gains, how does he favor or reconcile Theil's homosexuality?
Everything is cool when something is yours to use religion to justify but, if it is not it becomes debatable taboo, which curses the "others" for their somethings, on nothing more than, the whispers of the wind.
Let's kill more people because that represents social climbing, I heard that from Vance. I heard in the 16 interview, with Vance, that divorce and all the traditional shit, gone wrong, is because of the 25 year olds walking away from religion, but not at that elite YALE place, while he now attacks those foundations, for all the bad, and of what he claims he converted for. Does he control DNA? RNA? Personality? NO .
The Catholics, I knew, sinned all week and then confessed on Sunday. Slate clean!
Are they my issue to solve, call out, believe in or criticize? NO. Meaning those elected or are a part of the decisions that affect humanity and the world we are borrowing and shitting on.
They only owe me a vow, like their droning on marriage, or Oath to my liberties, freedoms, and not impose religion upon me, by upholding and defending the Constitution.
I'd like more sessions in Congress et. al about that subject versus the scrolls we will eventually, perhaps, find out about.
These folks with the inability to set-shift, running the country, should know what they're doing should be done away from the government and its policies, while having a balanced life, autonomous and true to convictions that don't need made public, and come back to their responsibilities to the country.
Actions speak louder than their beliefs in any denomination they "serve" or what Trump says. If they believe Trump they have problems far greater than a prayer session with Drollinger about supporting Israel will ever fix.
They vote as they do. Dems included. Their actions do nothing to impress upon me religion has done much for any of them.
Bible Mike Johnson telling people to "see the Bible if they want to know his beliefs", while having his son be his accountability partner and use an app to keep his wandering eye in check, while having a sketchy, at best, history, is absolute BS.
THE EXCUSE.
I talk to the air, because my faith is that there is something, as it has watched out for me for longer than I deserve, but who am I, to debate the trillion dollars of Medicaid cuts while debating who crucified Jesus?
It is looking at a puzzle book and playing the two picture, what is in one that ain't in the other, game.
It is ok to crime in the government now. Who needs religion as any excuse?
Right on, brother.
Sista, if you're on the current binary DEI WH rule club!!! :). But, brother is just fine with me!!!
To call this a “study” is generous. It’s a sermon with policy consequences, theological antisemitism shaping military support, all wrapped in breakfast and bureaucracy.
Scripture disguised as strategy. And the real question (though few dare ask, and fewer still will listen or answer): Whose kingdom is really being built?
The irony? It’s the powerful, *the so-called elites*, who figuratively crucify anything that might actually change the system for the better, when all is said… and (un)done.
Drollinger is someone worthy of only contempt. His scriptural gymnastics are like something out of Dr. Strangelove. He and his fucked-up followers are all part of a death cult that gleefully drags us all to Armageddon.
Drollinger and all those misguided fools that are listed as his "supporters" are the one who have truly been "Sidetracked" by the same stupid lies and fairy tales long pushed by white christian nationalists. It is beyond sickening.
One question, actually two. Could anyone but politicians do Bible study as part of their work day? What about the oath to uphold the Constitution and the part about separation of church and state? This is hyper religiosity at its finest. Disgusting.
As regards the latest post by Jonathan Larsen: N
I am Jewish, although atheist (it is possible, I suppose I could go into it if you really wanted, but that's not the point). My family and I have fought all of my life To prevent attempts of schools, teachers, park district employers, et cetera, from which I'm attempting to convert me to Christianity. How HOW DARE the politicians- the country that is built on freedom of religion continue that attempt?!! And to be honest, I may be Jewish, but neither I nor any living Jew (or Catholic for that matter) could POSSIBLY have had anything to do with killing a man, whether or not he was a “ messiah” a couple of thousand years ago?! And I won't even go into any religious questions involved! Just as one can't be blamed for their grandfather or other ancestor being a murderer, the question of current Jews being blamed for killing a man who was well revered at his time (and again, I won't even go into whether or not he actually existed...). And that our politicians could actually be TEACHING these myths as reality is just unbelievable. have they no SHAME? Do they not actually understand our constitution?- silly question [Clearly not, witness Trump..]
Jesus was well aware of his duty. He was well aware of the steps he needed to complete to confirm the Old Testament Biblical prophecy of his Messianic legitimacy. Judas’ betrayal? Without that, Jesus was not the guy. Keep looking. The Crucifiction. It was written. No Crucifiction. Sorry, not the Messiah. Keep waiting. The fact that Christians “blame” anyone for Jesus’ death or Judas’ role is ludicrous. They should rejoice these events. It should be seen as divine confirmation not condemnation. Bit of a logical hole in the story.
What was their White Anglo-Saxon Jesus doing in Jerusalem in the first place? He should’ve stayed in the still undiscovered America where he belonged. Right? 😉
The WAS (P pending for the next almost 1500 years) Jesus wouldn't have made it to Jerusalem. With that pale complexion he would have never returned after 40 days in the desert.
fnord
🤣🤣🤣🤣
Drollinger has what Richard Rohr would call an ego problem.
"In two study guides and videos, right-wing preacher Ralph Drollinger, who runs the Bible studies, made multiple references to Israel, or its people, killing Jesus."
Why would anyone doubt the good preacher (bless his heart) when it's an established fact that not only did the the filthy Jooz directly nailed the Christ to the tree (a shitload of them took turns pounding in the nails), but also that they kidnap good little Christians so they can kill them and drain their blood to make matzos.
-----
"Since Paul’s* a Jew, he doesn’t want his audience to know, well, what happens to the Jews, because they for by and large rejected the messiah."
* There are many, many more people in the world who ***don't*** consider the Christ as the Messiah; just ask a Buddhist, Hindu, Shinto, Zen, Muslim, Taoist, Sikh... if they view the Christ as the Messiah.
* The Jews in the time of the Christ looked upon him as a false prophet at best, and an agent of chaos within Judaism. Jews didn't (and don't) consider the Christ as the Messiah since he failed to meet the prophesies within Jewish holy books and traditions.
* Judaism recognizes that there will be a Messiah, but that the Christ isn't it. They see the Messiah as bringing forth world peace, justice, and a return to spiritualism. (I don't see most parishioners in the Americanized Evangelical movement as trying to do any of the three.) He will be human, not semi-divine or divine, and a direct descendant of King David -- that the Christ did fulfill according to long established Christian doctrine.
* As for peace and justice, Blaise Pascal said "Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction." Or as Thomas Paine said, "It is from the Bible that man has learned cruelty, rapine, and murder; for the belief of a cruel God makes a cruel man."
* I hate to be the one to break it to Drollinger, but not only Paul was a Jew. The Christ and all of the Disciples were Jewish also, as were most of those adherents of the Christ's teachings.
(* When Christianity was still in its infant stage, Paul was responsible for the first major schism in the Church. At this time one had to be Jewish to be Christian, while Paul said that all you needed was to believe:
> "◾ Some Jewish Christians insisted that Gentiles needed to fully convert to Judaism before becoming Christians, while others, like Paul, argued that faith in Christ was sufficient
◾The Council of Jerusalem, recorded in Acts 15, addressed this issue and reached a compromise position
...
◾ Gentile Christianity developed a distinct theological emphasis that set it apart from its Jewish roots
◾ Key concepts included the centrality of faith in Christ, the universal availability of salvation, and a reinterpretation of the role of Jewish law" https://fiveable.me/religions-of-the-west/unit-3/gentile-christianity/study-guide/V1sQvpf5RARkGGH6)
fnord
This is outrageous!
No. It's actually Christian doctrine. And it always has been. "News" such as this exists because people pick and choose factoids out of context instead of doing their homework.
No kidding. Who does that?
People should realize that some portions of Christian scripture were written by deeply flawed individuals who had an axe to grind.
it's cute you pretend you or anyone knows what "always has been" "actually Christian doctrine".
“And all the [Jewish] people answered, ‘His blood be on us and on our children!’”
- Matthew 27:25